Legal TV Sites

I started a new topic because i didn't want to hijack: lanocreviews.com/forum/23-off-topic/2651...v-shows-free-legally
But, why is it illegal to download shows on any of the major channels (ABC, NBC, CBS, Fox, PBS... check local listings)? They are broadcast for free, anyone with the right equipment can pick them up and watch them. Many Tv recorders will automatically remove the commercials for you or allow you to skip through them. So what's the big deal with downloading them from private trackers if they are already basically public domain?
I could see if someone else was burning them onto a DVD and selling them for a profit, but to just watch them once and delete them, i just don't see the harm or the difference in watching them when they are already free at 10 pm on a tuesday night, besides the fact that i dont have to stay up late to watch a show.

Major corporations are all about subscription revenue and complete control over the content they create. Fair use is dying rapidly. I am still somewhat amazed that MP3 purchases still do not have DRM. One wonders on that basis why video has not followed suit. I firmly believe the amount of piracy damage to corporations is massively overblown. I think it is fair to state that a large portion of the people that pirate video and software would never buy the legal alternative in the first place. Get rid of the DRM and make it cheap. People will pay for it legitimately. Look at what Louis C.K. has been doing with direct market videos without DRM and making a killing in the process. But I digress....

I believe a relatively samll portion of the population watches TV over the air. Most get it from cable or satellite. Cable and satellite providers have to pay the networks to rebroadcast their content. In turn, they want protections to ensure they make money on rebroadcasting network content. My attitude is this: If you have a cable or satellite service where your show was broadcast, and you missed it (DVR broke, working late, whatever), go ahead and download it from the tracker. You already paid to see the show. However, downloading those shows from torrents when you are not subscribing to some form of television service where those shows are available should be illegal.

trgtprctc wrote: My attitude is this: If you have a cable or satellite service where your show was broadcast, and you missed it (DVR broke, working late, whatever), go ahead and download it from the tracker. You already paid to see the show. However, downloading those shows from torrents when you are not subscribing to some form of television service where those shows are available should be illegal.

So if i pay for Cable or Satellite i should be able to download anything that i've paid for, but if i just watch the show via antenna (which i do) i shouldn't be able to download the show, even though it was available to me at the time the freely broadcast the show over the airwaves for anyone to pick up the signal and enjoy the programming? They can't control if i walk away from the TV set when the commercials come on so i don't see the advertising, in fact there is NO way for them to even see what i'm watching to count me towards their viewers to help get more sales of commercials.

I like your points, just wanted to see how you felt about my statement above.

They can track what your watching if its on cable, satellite etc. How do you think they compile viewership numbers? en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nielsen_ratings is one way. But since its just another form of networking and obviously that can be tracked. They get their numbers and adjust accordingly for the almighty revenue from commercials.

However if you walk away then leave the TV on its not a true rating.

good points from both of you!

Twodavez wrote:

trgtprctc wrote: My attitude is this: If you have a cable or satellite service where your show was broadcast, and you missed it (DVR broke, working late, whatever), go ahead and download it from the tracker. You already paid to see the show. However, downloading those shows from torrents when you are not subscribing to some form of television service where those shows are available should be illegal.

So if i pay for Cable or Satellite i should be able to download anything that i've paid for, but if i just watch the show via antenna (which i do) i shouldn't be able to download the show, even though it was available to me at the time the freely broadcast the show over the airwaves for anyone to pick up the signal and enjoy the programming? They can't control if i walk away from the TV set when the commercials come on so i don't see the advertising, in fact there is NO way for them to even see what i'm watching to count me towards their viewers to help get more sales of commercials.

I like your points, just wanted to see how you felt about my statement above.

Wingcmdr77 wrote: They can track what your watching if its on cable, satellite etc. How do you think they compile viewership numbers?

So i understand that Cable communicates two ways, but does all satellite recievers require some sort of internet connection so that they can track your usage? I always thought those dishes were recievers only and didn't transmit any data back to space, that's why if you wanted to buy a movie, you had to hook it up to the internet or phone line. Understand it's been 5+ years since i've had satellite/cable and haven't really looked into them since.

Commercials, it is how they make money also. When you download the person takes out the commercials and the company doesn't make money.

Satansoul wrote: Commercials, it is how they make money also. When you download the person takes out the commercials and the company doesn't make money.

Not really, they aren't getting paid per person who watches their commercial. If i Tivo a show or download it later and skip through the commercials, the ABC TV company doesn't loose or gain any extra money, because the Advertiser has paid a set fee to rent the airtime to show their product/commercial. They pay based upon how many people ABC anticipates watching the show, unless something has changed and they do work on commission... But again, how do they track people like me who watch over the air waves and don't pay a cable or other provider for services that are free...
If ABC lost money everytime you fast forwarded through the commercial on your DVR, you better believe they would remove that feature.

The long and the short of it Twodavez is that "the man" will likely never find you for downloading content that you could have viewed over the air. You fall into the perceived minority that still uses an antenna to receive significant amounts of content. I feel it comes down to perceived revenue loss for the media and advertising companies. Someone sitting behind a desk cannot fathom your innocent action could not possibly deprive them of billions in additional revenue to be divided amongst senior management and their favorite political parties, casinos, and brothels.

If you enjoy someones' product, support them with your hard earned dollars. The reality has become quite a bit more convoluted, though.

trgtprctc wrote: If you enjoy someones' product, support them with your hard earned dollars. The reality has become quite a bit more convoluted, though.

This is why i wish i could just start sending a check to HBO for making such great shows, but there is no way i'm going to get a $60 a month cable package to get the ability to pay extra for HBO... I agree in supporting things that are good, but with alot of the regurgitated crap out there (movies), it's hard to spend money on something without getting a good sample of the product first.Previews as we all know could be the only 4 funny parts of the movie, not a good representation of the show. Plus to see the different trailers on different sites shows how they totally market to the different audiences. Good, bad, ugly, this is the world we live in. I like the conversation though, lets try to keep it going.

For movies I still like to rent physical media. Using Netflix by mail or even Redbox makes the cost per title low enough, that if you get a steaming pile of crap, you are not out much. I agree that the movie channels on cable are an absolute rip off. If you want to watch Boardwalk Empire or some other popular movie channel series, you are forced to wait for the season DVD release, or fork out the montly subscription, or you may be tempted to pirate it.

Seen one of the newer Vonage commercials? If they threw in a puppy, maybe you would be more tempted to just take the bundle....

Not really, they aren't getting paid per person who watches their commercial.

Are you sure about that? If people are downloading show more and more instead of sitting through a commercial, would you pay to advertise on tv?

They main reason they do not want downloading it 2 fold -

1 the comercials are removed. Yes most FF thru them if they dvr the show but there is the time that people ff slow and see some of them, or see start of ome and get interested an actually watch a comercial so they have to protect their advertisers and go after downloaders. If they didnt go after them they would be telling their advertises eh we dont care if they watch em and then the advertisers would be eh we dont care about your show and now pay for comercials and then said show etc would be off the air etc.

2 - Almost all tv shows make it to DVD soon as the season is over if people can and we know they can DL these shows anytime they want then it hurts the dvd sales down the road as well

Also downloading does not get you to go to said channels website an watch it there which your forced to watch commercials.

I understand completly why they do not want dling. I have so many options to see a show I missed on the DVR that I seldom download shows anymore. There are a few that you cant see on demand or on channels website that I have dled due to dvr not recording or something but rare.

I am with Renegade on this this one. There are sooo many options to watch it legally I don't see a point in downloading them.

Arxon wrote: I am with Renegade on this this one. There are sooo many options to watch it legally I don't see a point in downloading them.

HBO

Thank you all for replying and for TwoDavez for restructuring the original topic allowing for all the great replies!

Wingcmdr77 wrote: They can track what your watching if its on cable, satellite etc. How do you think they compile viewership numbers? en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nielsen_ratings is one way. But since its just another form of networking and obviously that can be tracked. They get their numbers and adjust accordingly for the almighty revenue from commercials.

However if you walk away then leave the TV on its not a true rating.

good points from both of you!

Nielson Ratings will pay people for information on what they watch. To my knowledge there is no way the cable or Satellite providers pulls what you watch unless its from a DVR with and internet connection. Then they use that small basis of users to determine on how many people are watching specific shows.

Dreyvas wrote:

Arxon wrote: I am with Renegade on this this one. There are sooo many options to watch it legally I don't see a point in downloading them.

HBO

Smart ass

Arxon wrote:

Dreyvas wrote:

Arxon wrote: I am with Renegade on this this one. There are sooo many options to watch it legally I don't see a point in downloading them.

HBO

Smart ass